At this year's G-STAR game exhibition in South Korea, I met again with Tobias Stolz-Zwilling, the PR lead at Warhorse Studios—also known as Tobi.
It's quite奇妙. The last time we sat down to chat was in Poland, before Kingdom Come: Deliverance II was released. Tobi went to the Poznań Game Fair in Poland for promotion. And when we met again, Kingdom Come: Deliverance II had not only achieved considerable success but, barring any surprises, Henry's story was coming to an end.
"Monastery Mysteries" will be the final DLC for Kingdom Come: Deliverance II.
Speaking of which... it's quite melancholic.
Somehow, Henry, the man with that Tang smile, has become an important part of the lives of many players, including myself. He accompanied us as we rode horses, prayed, fought, adventured, saved the young lord, and hid from the Cumans' pursuit. When Henry laughed, we laughed; when Henry cried, we felt sad; when Henry fell in love, we smiled knowingly; when Henry entered the bathhouse, we also—wait, this part can't be broadcast.
In short, "Kingdom Come:Deliverance" is a great series. If possible, I truly hope this series can continue indefinitely—even though everyone here knows that's impossible.
Q: At the beginning of the interview, I must congratulate Kingdom Come: Deliverance II and Warhorse Studios on breaking 4 million copies in sales.
Your work has achieved such success; are you confident about winning the Game of the Year award at this year's TGA?
Tobi:It's too difficult, brother. That hope is too slim. 2025 is truly a year bursting with great titles. Look, we have Hollow Knight: Silksong, the热潮-raising Donkey Kong: Banana Force, and the new Battlefield™ 6...
Honestly, I think just being nominated for TGA is a big deal for Kingdom Come: Deliverance II. Who ultimately wins the award depends on the votes of the judges and players. If we win "Game of the Year," that would naturally be best—because as you know, a prestigious award acts like a catalyst for game sales.
After all, at the end of the day, the key to any game is sales—only by selling copies and making money can we maintain operations, pay salaries, and develop new games.
But having said that, if Kingdom Come: Deliverance II wins an award, we will gladly accept it. If it goes to another game, we won't have any objections.
In short, leave Everythinggj in God's hands.
Q: Players can see the achievements you've made, and I believe many will vote for Kingdom Come: Deliverance II. But having said that, the recently released DLC "Monastery Mysteries" seems to have quite a few bugs. Although I personally feel it's slightly inappropriate to mention "work" on a day meant for celebration, I believe many fans who love Kingdom Come: Deliverance II are currently troubled by various issues... This is indeed a very urgent situation.
Tobi:I see, that door didn't open, right? Phew! That's a terrible situation.
Kingdom Come: Deliverance II is a fairly complex game. In fact, every time we add something new, we conduct an internal quality review before officially releasing it. However, in practice, unexpected issues always pop up in the game. That door didn't open, and the DLC story guide was hiding behind it—this is indeed terrible. But perhaps during testing, the guide happened to be wandering outside, and the quest triggered normally... BOOM! You see, we had no way of discovering the issue.
In fact, I've already seen many people discussing this on the forums. Some say if you fast-forward for a while in place, the DLC guide will come out on their own.
Sometimes, these bugs resolve themselves under very strange circumstances, and sometimes they don't. And often, these bugs don't appear during our self-review—it's just too complex and unpredictable.
We're not saying we intentionally left these problems, but I can assure you that we are urgently fixing them and will soon release a hotfix patch—which should resolve these exposed issues.
But as you know, the scale of Kingdom Come: Deliverance II is no small feat, and any fixes require considerable time and effort.
Q: Speaking of RPGs, do you know the nickname Chinese players give to the most common type of quest in these games, where "A sends you to B, B sends you to C, and then C sends you to D"? It's called "unclogging the toilet"—a monotonous, mechanical chore. But Kingdom Come: Deliverance II also has its share of "toilet unclogging," lots of it, yet these tasks feel very different. I still remember the guy with an arrow stuck in his head whom I met while fast traveling, and the story of helping the bathhouse owner recruit female scrubbers—you know the drill—which ended up throwing a lively bathhouse party.
Stripped of their outer layer, these quests are essentially "A finds B, B finds C, and then C finds D"—"unclogging the toilet." But my feeling is completely different. How did you achieve this?
Tobi:Haha, I know what you mean. This is indeed a great question. Of course, "unclogging the toilet"—what a great metaphor—actually, we don't have any magical solution.
When designing these most common RPG quest lines, what we probably do most is avoid meaningless elements—we want to make every character more interesting and valuable. Even if players are doing simple tasks like "unclogging the toilet," we hope these quests can bring players novel experiences, funny moments, and interesting discoveries.
Q: Like diving into a cesspit to find the strongest bow in the game?
Tobi:Haha, exactly. We want players to gain a lot from the game, whether it's happiness, sadness, or—crap (bursting into laughter). We won't give you simple and boring quests like, "Hero, my belongings were robbed by bandits, can you bring me 20 rabbits?" Even if we really need players to perform such delivery tasks, we hope they go to interesting places, meet interesting people, or encounter topics worth discussing.
For example, knowing that many players will complain about the sack-carrying task in Kingdom Come: Deliverance II, but this is exactly what we want players to experience—the heaviness, the heat from the sun... Isn't this immersion mixed with pain and achievement the new experience we expect?
Q: Exactly, I believe immersion is the soul of the "Kingdom Come: Deliverance" series. Just like when I played Kingdom Come: Deliverance, I lowered my helmet visor, and it really blocked most of my field of view.
But now many developers think that this so-called "immersion" is unnecessary. As we mentioned earlier with carrying sacks, players experience the weight of the sack and feel the pain. But to them, this "pain" is not necessary. In fact, many players also say things like, "Life is already so tiring, why not find something more enjoyable?"
As a developer, what are your thoughts on this?
Tobi:First off, I certainly don't have the authority to judge others' game designs, but I must explain our core philosophy—our interpretation of role-playing games lies in creating an immersive experience. We want players to genuinely feel that every action has its logical basis, just as mentioned earlier regarding "unclogging the toilet"—all actions should have tangible effects.
Then, when players discover certain details in the game or do small things that should be immersive—like when you pick up a bottle, your arm naturally reaches out to grab the item; or if you hand a bowl to someone and keep it still for a long time, the bowl will start to shake.
With these details, you will believe you are truly doing something. I think this is very important because realism and immersion stem from this.
This is how Warhorse Studios developers understand RPGs. When developing games—or more accurately, when developing the "Kingdom Come: Deliverance" series—we don't adjust the game based on notions like "we should make players feel good" or "how can we make money if players aren't happy."
When we make games, we don't look at materials like "sales secrets" or "how to sell millions of copies of your game." Our entire team gathers together and starts discussing—what do we want to play? What is fun? What sounds cool?
Q: Like letting the protagonist jump into a cesspit? Or tasting poop at the saltpeter works?
Tobi:Haha, man, stop (another burst of laughter). Phew, poor Henry. Where were we? Right, design. We sit together and ask ourselves—do you think this VR feature has potential? Then someone might say, "Alright, but wearing a headset in the real world is too heavy and annoying," and another person says, "VR is fine, but shouldn't we first ensure the game runs well and is fun enough?" etc.
So, the key point is always this—the game must be fun and interesting. Therefore, when we start weighing how to design, fun and gameplay are always the primary considerations—of course, we've been listening to player feedback, and we try to accommodate these additional elements as much as possible.
If it's realistic and reasonable enough, we will strive to incorporate it.
Q: Is the balance between realism and gameplay the design language behind "Saviour Schnapps"?
Tobi:"Saviour Schnapps" is actually a community idea. During our feedback collection, someone said, "Hey! We're Czechs. Isn't it normal for us to wake up after drinking and find that half the time has disappeared?" Then the director responded, "Hmm, that's a good idea." So, we adopted it. Hmm... What I actually want to say is that we created "Saviour Schnapps" following another one of our design philosophies—we want players to respect their choices.
We hope that no matter what players plan to do, when they hesitate for even a millionth of a second before saving and loading, and then firmly choose to face life head-on, it will be worth it.
We actually don't want players to treat the "save and load" function as Everythinggj. Because in "Kingdom Come: Deliverance," once you make a choice, the story continues, and the game keeps running. We believe that letting players create their own stories is the core of the "Kingdom Come: Deliverance" series.
Q: However, isn't the most famous technique among RPG players abusing the save and load functions? I think most people, when making choices, want to take the easy way out by saving to prevent themselves from heading towards a bad ending—this is the only remaining trick for us realistic players trying to escape the weight of choice in the virtual world.
Tobi:Isn't this the meaning behind "Saviour Schnapps"? We haven't completely blocked players from doing this. But we believe that this small bottle of "Saviour Schnapps"—an item that requires players to scavenge or brew themselves—can prevent players from completely entering a carefree comfort zone.
It's actually quite nice to let some players who don't mind going with the flow just go with the flow.
Q: As far as I know, the "Saviour Schnapps" mechanic is loved by some and hated by others in the player community, with very clear-cut support and opposition.
Tobi:You have to understand that we designers sometimes need to stand firm in our design stance and clearly express—this is our design philosophy, and this is the solution we want to achieve. But then again, players can use mods to remove this mechanism, or just cheat to get hundreds of bottles of "Saviour Schnapps"—so, ultimately, it all depends on the player's choice.
Q: What about weapon balance? I remember that in the 1.3 version update, you significantly nerfed longswords without strengthening other weapons much. Is this also about balancing gameplay and realism?
Tobi:Each update and patch brings new changes, and we are constantly striving to optimize game balance. Therefore, the first major patch strengthened NPC enemies because they were too easy to deal with previously. So, these changes are essentially adjustments for a role-playing game. Moreover, although we adjusted weapon damage to ensure an immersive RPG experience, players can still grind levels heavily on the first map and then rampage freely on the second map.
Q: I can guarantee this point. I have a friend who hasn't entered the wedding storyline even after 20 hours. Players will definitely scour the first map clean before moving on to the second map.
Tobi:To be honest, we didn't expect players to stay on the first map for so long either.
Q: I encountered a bug that I'm not sure if it was caused by mods. To prepare for a version update, I uninstalled some decorative mods. Then, after entering the monastery and returning, I found that all the decorations, weapons, and other items hanging in the room had disappeared.
Tobi:Ah, that was a bug, and it wasn't really related to your decorative mods. This is confirmed information because many players reported this bug, and we are fixing it—this was definitely not our intention. However, sometimes I still want to emphasize that we strongly support mods, but players also need to be aware of the stability issues that can arise from using community content.
Q: Since we're talking about monasteries, let's get to the point—Kingdom Come: Deliverance II's "Monastery Mysteries" is obviously very different in experience and difficulty from Kingdom Come: Deliverance, being much simpler. Why is that?
Tobi:Actually, our design philosophies for the monastery maps in the two games are completely different.
The monastery in Kingdom Come: Deliverance is more like a "sealed chamber." We want players to immersively experience medieval monastic life and then understand the monks—or become a madman wielding a one-handed hammer.
And in Kingdom Come: Deliverance II's "Monastery Mysteries," Henry assists the doctor in finding a cure in an official capacity, only to discover the hidden secrets behind it—like a detective stumbling into a case, somewhat akin to an Indiana Jones-style puzzle-solving adventure.
Honestly, the atmosphere of the monasteries in both games is similar, but the experience doesn't share the same design logic.
Q: Speaking of which, didn't Cyberpunk 2077's last DLC, "Phantom Liberty," make a similar choice by telling a detective mystery story—even though players could have fought their way through from the start? Do you think this design philosophy, which gives players the power to cause chaos but encourages them to hold back and explore other possibilities, is similar to Kingdom Come: Deliverance II's "Monastery Mysteries"?
Tobi:Phew, that's a difficult but good question. I think there are some differences. "Monastery Mysteries" doesn't emphasize combat that much; the focus is entirely on puzzle-solving. I think the overall narrative is stronger than the first two DLCs for Kingdom Come: Deliverance II—after all, the first two DLCs added quite a few new features to the game.
In fact, to give the "Kingdom Come: Deliverance" series a perfect conclusion, we specially designed this innovative ending—through Henry's final adventure, we explored themes not covered in the previous two works for the first time, such as the patterns of disease spread and how late medieval monasteries dealt with epidemics.
Q: Although combat isn't the main focus—you still gave players plenty of opportunities to obtain weapons very early in the story, didn't you? As far as I know, you can get a longsword at the starting training ground.
Tobi:But you also have to admit that if you go on a killing spree, the whole story basically falls apart.
Q: Speaking of which, you mentioned wrapping up earlier—so, is Kingdom Come: Deliverance III off the table?
Tobi:Currently, our focus is still on fixing various issues with the "Monastery Mysteries" DLC for Kingdom Come: Deliverance II, such as bugs and optimization. But we are also working on a new project—specific details won't be announced until next year. But I can confirm that the new project will still be an RPG; we won't be leaving our comfort zone for now.
However, let me keep the specifics under wraps for now; it's all too early to tell.
The decision-makers above me will determine our direction. Perhaps we'll start development on several projects simultaneously soon, or maybe not.
Q: So, there are no development plans for Kingdom Come: Deliverance III? Even though that era in the main storyline features fascinating characters and stories like Jan Žižka, Jan Hus, and Sigismund?
Tobi:At this moment, I can't say "yes" or "no." We hope the "Monastery Mysteries" DLC will bring closure to this story—this was our vision when we launched the Kickstarter campaign in 2014. The story has truly reached its end.
You see, the Father's Sword forged by Henry's adoptive father has officially become Henry's sword. Perhaps we will return to the "Kingdom Come: Deliverance" series later, but Henry's story has ended. Some things just won't have definite answers—whether temporarily shelving a hot IP is good or not is also like this.
Q: Speaking of which, the original Kingdom Come: Deliverance also released a DLC playing from Theresa's perspective, I think it was called "From the Ashes"—allowing us to experience the events of the fall of Skalitz from the heroine's point of view.
Why didn't Kingdom Come: Deliverance II release similar DLCs that offer new perspectives?
Tobi:We still hope to bring some novel experiences to players. The "From the Ashes" DLC did give many players a new direction, but that already appeared in the previous game. So, for Kingdom Come: Deliverance II, we wanted to do something different—such as enriching blacksmithing, letting Henry truly become a blacksmith, or giving players the chance to decorate their own houses with ornaments and such.
Just thinking about an actor laughing like that makes me want to laugh.
Q: So this is probably the last question—have you ever thought about bringing Henry's story to the big screen? Like a movie or TV series?
Tobi:Oh yes, yes, I recently learned a new term—multi-platform IP, which refers to this. Actually, we have already started producing an animated film. Of course, if it could be made into a live-action movie, that would be even better. And personally, I really hope to see the "Kingdom Come: Deliverance" story become a movie and TV series.
We are still researching this—but rest assured, we are not old-fashioned folks who only focus on games as a single medium.